More information on the Minecraft 1.7.2 update

Discussion in 'Bukkit News' started by EvilSeph, Nov 16, 2013.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
     
  1. Offline

    EvilSeph Bukkit Team Lead Administrator

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Things are progressing nicely towards our first development build of CraftBukkit for Minecraft 1.7.2. Although this update did not provide or add as much feature-wise as previous Minecraft updates have, this is probably one of the more complicated and larger updates we've had to work with from a mod development standpoint. With "almost all of [the code in Minecraft] having been changed - be it little or big" (according to Mojang), there has been significant shifting around of code and logic - to the estimated tune of ~220k lines changed - within Minecraft, resulting in our slowest and most involved update yet.

    Managing expectations - information about our initial CraftBukkit 1.7.2 builds
    Five days ago (on November 10th) I sent out a tweet trying to describe what our initial findings were regarding the impact this Minecraft update has on the project but it's frustratingly very difficult to communicate everything I want or need to in 140 characters. Nonetheless, sending out tweets is still our best form of communication that doesn't push other important topics out of view (like the potential structure loss PSA).

    The tweet was meant to explain that while we will definitely have development builds, our analysis and evaluation of the update (through reading the code and following Minecraft feedback/bug reports from the community) has revealed that there are issues in Minecraft that may prevent us from getting anything stable or reliable out. This was purely meant to assist us with managing expectations as to the quality, stability and reliability of any builds we're able to give out.

    As for the 'issues we cannot fix' aspect of the tweet, this is due to the nature and policies of the Bukkit project: it is not so much that we are unable to fix the issues ourselves (though this can sometimes be the case), but rather that the issues present are not the project's responsibility to fix and, instead, would be better addressed by Mojang. While we do sometimes make exceptions if we have a really good reason to do so (like to fix a security issue), we try and avoid altering the way Minecraft itself behaves and functions. This is both a conscious decision as a project and a necessity, as too many changes to Minecraft's inner workings can mean significant increases in the complexity and amount of work required for the update process.

    It's not so much that we choose not to fix these issues, but rather that we need to be fully conscious and aware of the impact doing so could have on the update process and our day-to-day maintaining of the project. If the fix for an issue touches too many internals within Minecraft, for example, it usually makes the update process significantly more complex, resulting in (what could be an avoidable) increase in the amount of time it takes us to update. As much as we'd like to fix every issue we come across, doing so would mean updating to new Minecraft versions will take even longer than they currently do.

    This is why we have the minimal diffs policy (a policy which eliminates unnecessary changes to the Minecraft code), it results in a speedier and less buggy update for everyone. Although it undoubtedly limits the developers in our project, I think you'll agree that it's a worthy sacrifice and limit to impose upon ourselves in order to ensure that the downtime of your server between updates is as minimal as we can possibly achieve.

    If we were not personally responsible for updating the core of our project, we'd have much more freedom to experiment. As it is, however, the Bukkit project handles updating, development and the maintaining of both a plugin API (Bukkit) and a Minecraft server mod (CraftBukkit) in order to produce the server you all know and love.

    To be clear:
    • There WILL be development builds; we're still working towards getting our first one out.
    • Due to significant changes in how Minecraft works, it will take us a while to get our Bukkit API updated. Hence, it is highly unlikely that all the plugins you are using will work on our initial development builds.
    • There will MOST LIKELY be promoted builds, but they'll be lower quality than you could usually expect from us due to issues we can't address.
    What does updating CraftBukkit involve?
    To give you an idea as to why this update is taking longer than usual, I need to briefly touch on what our update process involves. Every time a Minecraft update is released, we have to go through a repetitive, time consuming and dry multi-step process.

    A simple breakdown of the process is as follows: decompile the server -> learn the new names (they change with every update) -> figure out how they apply to Bukkit's naming system -> learn what changed/what's new in the update -> update the changes we make to the server to support Bukkit -> get the code to compile -> fix issues that come up.

    Since we're working with a code base that is unfamiliar to us, we can sometimes find ourselves having to jump back to a previous step. For example: we may come across a piece of code that we're not familiar with and once we're able to figure out what it does, we realise that we've named something incorrectly which we then have to go back and fix. It is this fluid and unpredictable aspect of the update process that makes it difficult to come up with a communicable ETA or any progress/status updates.

    Though this process may seem inefficient or ineffective, this is the same process that we've used and improved upon to get all of our updates out (even our fastest ones) over the 3 years the project has existed. Bear in mind, the overview provided here barely touches the surface of our update process and is intended to give you a remote idea as to what we have to deal with for every update. This brief and simplified breakdown of our 'steps' does little to explain the varying level of difficulty or complexity of each step, for example.

    How can I help?
    The best way to help us out is to get involved.

    If you're a server admin: once we have our first development build out, we'd appreciate any testing you could perform and any issues you can report. Please bear in mind that development builds are unsupported and should not be run on production servers.

    If you're a plugin developer: once we have our first development build out with proper API support, we'd appreciate if you could test the build out and report any missing or broken API to our bug tracker.

    If you're looking to help us out with the update, you'll have to work towards that goal by getting involved in other aspects of the project first. Due to the sensitive and extremely team oriented nature of the update process, we require that you build a relationship and demonstrate your commitment to the project before getting involved with updating will benefit the process. As the update process is incredibly repetitive and mundane, intense commitment is a key requirement for the team.

    We know this update is taking longer than usual but I assure you we are working our hardest to get it done. Thanks for your patience and continued support, it makes a huge difference and really helps us push onward!

    This post has been edited 2 times. It was last edited by EvilSeph Nov 16, 2013.
  2.  
  3. Offline

    chaseoes BukkitDev Staff

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Thanks for the update! Keep up the great work. :)
    Jamboozlez, AlexMl and krys5284 like this.
  4. Offline

    joseph96

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Many thanks to the whole team!

    Keep up the good work!

    Your work is very much appreciated!

    Thanks for the update!
    amp984 likes this.
  5. Offline

    Cyral

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Thanks for the update, keep up the hard work!
  6. Offline

    OverclockRespawn

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Good Job!

    Keep it up!
  7. Offline

    JustinBaldeo

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Just as I was about to give up on minecraft, and my server... Thanks for the update, I feel more confident.
  8. Offline

    Gonzalineitor

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Good work!
    Thanks you for your support and for the update!
    Keep it up!
  9. Offline

    vasil7112

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Thanks for the update <3
  10. Offline

    TNTUP

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Finally XD Thanks for the Update EvilSeph! Sure ill tests my plugins on a test server (Copying production server) so I can notice what broke.. I just hope so MV will work...
  11. Offline

    Ultimate_n00b

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Why would you give up on the people who gave you the power to make your server in the first place..
  12. Offline

    StalePhish

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    I really don't mind you guys having ads, but having ads that show large "Start download" buttons that point to who knows what is crossing into some serious gray areas, especially since this article is about something people are in a rush to download.

    [IMG]

    This post has been edited 1 time. It was last edited by StalePhish Nov 16, 2013.
    felixfritz, tyzoid, vivosims and 21 others like this.
  13. Offline

    sean_skroht

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Thanks for the update. It sounds like an extremely intense and involved process.

    Just a question though, and this is purely for informational purposes:

    A year or so ago I remember the Bukkit team visited Mojang and, unless I got it wrong, were in discussions about including the Bukkit API into Minecraft, or at least providing some sort of plugin/modding API to make the whole process of updating much, much easier. I also thought that this would allow the Bukkit devs to be kept up to date with the latest changes in Minecraft.

    Whatever happened to this? I would have thought by now that due to the popularity of Bukkit this would have been implemented, thereby allowing the latest Minecraft releases to include a plugin API and thus eliminate the tedium and stress no doubt associated with having to learn the changes and the new code.

    Would someone be able to clarify?

    This post has been edited 1 time. It was last edited by c0mp Nov 16, 2013.
  14. Offline

    ThunderGemios10

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Thanks EvilSeph for the Update!
  15. Offline

    AoH_Ruthless

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Keep up the hard work!
  16. Offline

    ThunderGemios10

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    lol yeah
    Mike1022 and cs34026 like this.
  17. Offline

    cookiemonsta41

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    good job, will the dev builds support the new world generation of biomes?
  18. Offline

    grid21

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    If I test the first dev build on my home computer could I report bugs on the Github project for the dev build? Or is there an official means of reporting bugs? I want to help you guys get this new version out and I really believe in the Bukkit project! :)
  19. Offline

    evilmidget38 BukkitDev Staff BukkitDev Staff

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    You can report bugs on leaky.bukkit.org.
  20. Offline

    JustinBaldeo

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Not that, I was going to give up minecraft in total.
  21. Offline

    worstboy32

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    And Mojang even said they wanted each update to have more lines changed xD.
    So next update is probably gonna be even worse.

    Might be a good idea to communicate with Mojang about that and if that's the case start looking for a bigger team or another solution if updates get bigger and bigger people will complain more and more :p.
    I don't really care that it's taking long I fully understand it but at some point you will probably need to look for options. Like Mojang hired more developers that means bigger updates.
    I understand it's hard to just expand the team or come up with a good solution but you guys should really think about it if you haven't already.

    Anyways keep up the great work :)
    GudPiggeh and Tomographix like this.
  22. Offline

    rangewonk

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Good luck on fixing the problems smoothly and quickly.

    Can't wait for the build to be released and thank you for trying hard or sorting this out!

    Respect.
  23. Offline

    Prothean_IGS

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Thanks for the update, means a lot! Keep up the hard work, no matter how long it takes we all appreciate it!
  24. Offline

    theearlypc423

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Awesome! I will report any issues I find with the API
  25. Offline

    TennaShasta

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Its great that you guys are making progress, but do you know about how much more time until bukkit 1.7 development builds come out?
  26. Offline

    pilot3101

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Thanks for the update!! Keep up all your guys hard work!! :D Diamond for you guys! [IMG]
    myrrdin777 and ThunderGemios10 like this.
  27. Offline

    Intangir

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    this project is the only reason minecraft is even still relevant

    youd think mojang would do more to assist you, rather than doing everything in their power to made it impossibly hard

    obfuscating their code when they should be delivering the api themselves like they promised for the last couple years..

    mojang is so stupid
    Rexel, FirecatHD, Europia79 and 2 others like this.
  28. Offline

    TechuntrTM

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    I have been running servers on and off since Bukkit came out. Since I can't start my next server without this, I will defiantly help out where I can. I love to test (portal reference).
  29. Offline

    freakyautumn

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    Awesome! I will test some stuff after the release and let you all know.
  30. Offline

    TheLecturer

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    New to Minecraft and Bukkit this year, so this may be a noob question, but why don't Mojang work closer with you guys? Bukkit is clearly a fundamental part of the success of Minecraft - imagine the uproar, and decline in sales, if the Bukkit team just said "You know what? Screw it, we've had enough".

    Anyway, keep up the good work. Waiting patiently :)
  31. Offline

    cs34026

    dev.bukkit.org profile:
    CFUSERNAME
    My Plugins (CFCOUNT)
    Minecraft account:
    MCUSERNAME
    I want to say thank you for making such a great program that literally changes minecraft into what it is today without you guys I guaruntee mc might have died out Thank you for all your hard work and perseverence. I would like to help you test these builds by running any build you need tested I have a secondary server (technically) that i would be willing to use to help you out with whatever comes your way for the meantime but soon ima stop paying for it to cover more on my main one. You guys are my heroes when it comes to mc and i know you will work hard and persevere till the end. Thank you team craftbukkit for all that you have done.
    Brian_Entei likes this.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page